Messing with Varnish

Anyone try altering a varnish?

It is basically a solvent (turpentine) and a mixture of oils (china tree oil, tung oil and linseed oil) and a drier, right? What about adding a little pine tar to say, Captains Varnish? I'm looking to get a little more amber in my exterior finish. I can't see how it would hurt, maybe do it on a coat or two.

I have an experiment brewing right now on some scraps.

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Permalink Reply by Randy Dersham on March 16, 2009 at 8:54pm
Dave, I'm down on varnish and up on polyurethane. If you want a darker look then use water based wood dye to get the color you are after and use Bristol Finish. Bristol really does last much longer than varnish. It's only drawback is it is a two part that you roll on then tip off once and don't go back and touch it again. If you have drips wait until it drys then sand them out and do another thin coat.

Varnish is a classic look but breaks down in the sun much faster than poly and requires more care.
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on March 17, 2009 at 5:56am

Randy,
on one of my older boats i did with fir plywood, I did a water based wood dye and it looked great. I did 6 coats of varnish over it and the combination of the amber in the varnish over the dyed wood was/is stunning.

I hear you about poly, but......I have a gallon and a half of Captains sitting here that needs to get used up.

Thanks!
Permalink Reply by Greg Hatten on March 17, 2009 at 6:49am
Dave,
Wow... that looks GREAT. I really like the grain in the wood - you did a nice job picking the right pieces. Very cool.
GH
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on March 17, 2009 at 8:10am
Thats my old boat. I think that was 2003. That is fir, and the quality was pretty good. That finish was hours of time. If you ever try to stain a piece of wood that big, you got to worry about making it patchy. It worked out. nice boat.

Now, I can't find good fir for nothing. I am building a meranti boat right now, and its nice looking too. I'm looking for a little more amber in my meranti- I already coated it twice with epoxy. The Captains spar is amber, but I would like to add more. The pine tar is helping based on my experiments.

You'll see it soon.
Permalink Reply by Randy Dersham on March 17, 2009 at 8:29am
That really is a fantastic look. One of the best I've seen. Great job.
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on March 17, 2009 at 6:48pm
Randy, Greg,

Thanks a bunch those are some serious compliments coming from guys like you.

I'll try and find some better pics of her on water.

Thanks!

Dave
Permalink Reply by Greg Hatten on March 17, 2009 at 7:39pm
I'd love to see that boat on the McKenzie... how is April shaping up for you?? You could float and fish your way here??
GH
Permalink Reply by Jesse Ronnow on March 17, 2009 at 7:53pm
Dave,

Man that looks good. The boat I am working on now is fir. I am oiling the interior but am struggling to identify how dark / light I want the finish to be... understanding that it will darken over time... That looks stunning.

Jesse
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on March 18, 2009 at 7:05pm
Greg,

That sounds like a plan.... But I don't think it will happen just yet!!! I can dream though!


Jesse- That brown boat has:

water based stain
2 coats epoxy
6 or so coats of varnish.

It was alot of work, but worth it. I did it when the side panels were flat. Tis boat is a real looker on the river. I'm going to post another photo once I find it..

I made two sets of panels for this boat. One set made this boat, the other made a different boat.
This finish will not darken over time, but it may get a little "warmer" from the amber due to additional varnish.

If you oil inside (i recommend) Depending on what you do for oil will have alot ot do with darkening it.

Off the bat, if you use the old down east formula (I do), You can play with the color. Pine tar will add considerable darkness. Less tar make sit lighter. UV will also age it a bit. plain boiled linseed and turpentine mixed 1:1 is also suitable. I used this on one boats floor and its fine. (The Trapper) .

What will probably affect it the most is the dirt, mud and junk you will bring into the boat. even the best hosedown will still leave some crud in the wood. Oil over that and it adds to the patina.

I am not as familiar as Randy is with the commercially available oils- there is a thread on this, but I hear some of them are very good and some are very light. I like the old formula because I find myself using it on alot of outside projects around the house. fences posts- mailbox post, outdoor benches and furniture. If you buy the right stuff to make it, it is a very "green" finish and not petroleum based.

1 qt turp
1 qt boiled linseed
1/2 pint Pine tar -or suit to taste (color that is!)
Dash of Japan Drier. This flutuates. I'll leave it out on the initial coats because I like it to soak in a long time. Then I take my remainder and put in some drier to evaporate it off faster so it is not tacky.
I've done my boats in the full sun in the heat of the day. Soaks in nice. smells great.
Permalink Reply by Jesse Ronnow on March 18, 2009 at 8:02pm
Dave,

I was swayed to the oil interior by you a few weeks ago. I really hope that the Dek's stuff Randy has hasn't changed. The boats I have seen with that are gorgeous.

The outside of my boat is a deep red (paint). Very rich and dark. I am trying to keep the interior light to provide a contrast, and to cut down on the extra heat generated by darker finishes out on the river. But that darker finish is hard to resist. I think in my next boat I will oil the whole thing and go very dark on the outside.... who knows.

Thanks for all your experience and insight.

Jesse
Permalink Reply by Chris Anderson on October 11, 2010 at 9:00pm
May I ask what the water based wood dye was? Is it in the thread above or did you use something different? I want this look and would love to know what the mixture is - I don't believe I can compete with this look but would like to try. Thanks

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