Wooden Boat People
By McKenzieDriftBoat.com
Nails verses Screws
I understand that ringshank nails hold as well a screws. What are the pros and cons of these fasteners for attaching the sides and bottom to the frames?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Randy Dersham on
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I use silicone bronze ring nails on the sides because they are pretty. Roger Fletcher talked me into trying it and I haven't gone back to screws.
I use screws for the bottom because they are easier to unscrew and patch if I miss a bottom frame. That happens once in a while if I snap the chalk line on the bottom frame wacky. Heh, Sandy doesn't let me screw down bottoms any more.
There is lots of talk about if a screw or ring nail has a better grip. I think for the drift boat the differences are very arguable and they are interchangeable.
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Permalink Reply by Jerry Thompson on
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Thanks Randy. That sounds reasonable. What about using Titebond III between the frames and sides. I keep reading about how hard it is to clean up 3m 5200 and I have no experence with it yet. Of course, I will use it between the floor frames and the bottom but I just cain't get comfortable not using something to keep the sides in place. I would think that nails or screws alone would work the holes out as the craft flexes and allow water to enter.
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Jerry, we use 3m 5200 on the chine log and the bottom. We are now using a thin line of West Systems Six10 when we nail in the frames. It comes in a caulking tube and has a mix tube that I like a lot. The Six 10 does not sag and is easier to clean than the 3m 5200.
Like boats, there is no such thing as a perfect glue. The epoxy mixes are tough but stiff, the 3M5200 is flexible but messy, and TightBond III is great above a waterline but not for a place that is allowed to soak in the water.
So we use 3M 5200 the bottom of the boat and chine log, West Systems Six 10 epoxy for frames, and TightBond III for seats and interior parts.
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Permalink Reply by Dave Z on
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They are dang sexy against Meranti and when they age they become almost invisible. The cons are they can be a pain in the butt even if you pre-drill holes, especially in hard wood like white Oak.. Once they are hammered into the shank, they cannot be removed. On side panels I suspect it doesn't take much to hold a panel against a frame, so I don't believe there is much issue with strength. If you are putting a nail every 4 inches down a frame, how much holding power do ya really need? Once those panels have been bent around a frame for a so long, they probably conform to the boat shape and don't have a tendancy to want to pull away.
#14 by 1" or 1-1/4" Jamestown Distributors. 1 pound is more than enough for one boat.
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How big is a # 14 and what size drill do you use with them?
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I don't remember the drill size, but you want it just under the size of the shank. #14 is pretty close just under 1/8" I think.
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Permalink Reply by Mike Baker on
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Hey Jerry,
I use #14x1-1/4. I pre- drill with 1/16 or 5/64 in to soft wood as in the side frames. use 3/32 or even 4/64 if going into hardwood like the stem.
I am with Randy on using screws for the bottom for the reason he mentioned plus screws let you pull the bottom real tight. I get what Dave says about how much does an adhesive give you on the sides but I still use one. I have used Titebond, Plastic Resin glue, 5200 and epoxy. I feel the Titebond and Plastic resin Glue don't have enough open time, 5200 has plenty but cleanup SUCKS! I now use Epoxy. Plenty of working time and clean up is actually not bad at all if you use lacquer thinner.
Mike
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Permalink Reply by Lawrence E. Long on
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Randy, Z and the boys have it "nailed". I don't predrill when going into soft woods but oak needs it. One thing I like to do is counterbore the place for the nail VERY slightly with a 1/4 " brad point bit. It countersinks the nail head to where it is flush with the PW. Also like to use a 6 oz or so small ballpene hammer and fairly ligt taps. You don't need a 16oz framing hammer. Ring shanks tend to bend when not hit squarely
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