Rapid Robert Floor Issue

I am currently starting a rapid robert from Roger Fletcher's great book. I want to know: if the floor boards were removed to reduce weight for some trips, would there be any chance of doing damage to the boat from walking or placing gear directly on the bottom?  It will be a 1/2" plywood and glassed bottom.  I realize the frames will make moving around awkward but having to carry the boat across some low places is no picnic.  Any insight into this will be of great help.

thanks,
Larry 

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Permalink Reply by Randy Dersham on February 6, 2010 at 5:13pm
Good feed back Dave. A couple of comments about boat bottoms.

I am using the fiberglass bottom as a replacement for UHMW. It is much more slick than wood and a distinct advantage on water where you might run up on a rock. The plywood bottom is more sticky. I'm also using only a 1/2 fir floor. I've abandoned Meranti on the bottom for the reasons you mention. Sepele should never be used for a boat bottom, it is much too brittle.

The UHMW is very slick which is why so many like it here in the NW. The two disadvantages is it transfers energy, just as you mentioned, and it must be screwed on, which can lead to rot problems years later.

The Fiberglass bottom is very slick and much more rot free than UHMW yet it still transfers energy.

The bottom approach you are talking about was often done with a treated architectural plywood called FinPly. The skid plate was not usually adhered to the boat bottom but was held in place with screws so it could be replaced every few years. UHMW replaced it; however, the inherent rot problems resulting from screws into the bottom was made worse by UHMW because it expands and contracts so radically. It left unattended for years it can literally unscrew itself.

A fourth approach some have had good luck with was a Formica skid plate. I've seen a couple from the 60s that are still going strong.
Permalink Reply by Randy Dersham on February 6, 2010 at 5:25pm
Thoughts on the encapsulated boat.

A boat properly encapsulated with epoxy and a good UV protection is still a viable and beautiful solution. You are correct that the wood cannot breath as it does with oil; however, for the people that want a shiny bright boat a correctly encapsulated boat is a good solution. Many of the "encapsulated" boats with problems were boats that encapsulated with varnish.

Where people run into the rot problem is with Varnish breakdown and using Varnish instead of epoxy to encapsulate.

Many builders have varnished all the parts before they built the boat. They then do their build and add more varnish as a final finish. A boat built that way has no epoxy protection. Varnish is more brittle than epoxy so a varnished only joint is a candidate for a cracked varnish leak. Varnish is also the highest maintenance option. As you mentioned, this technique is asking for rot down the road.

A boat that has all parts epoxied, then built, then another coat of epoxy after the build to seal all of the joints, then protected with a strong UV clear or colored Polyurethane is an encapsulated boat that can last a lifetime. With a little careful watching of joints and immediate fixing of any breaks of the encapsulation you should be able to prevent wet wood and potential rot.

I'm not saying that one is better than the other. The oiled approach is the tried and true historic approach. The encapsulated approach is more modern, more expensive, and takes longer to build; however, it is the way to get that beautiful wood shine finish.
Permalink Reply by Charles Ray Heater on February 7, 2010 at 9:38am
I agree with Randy. His comments above are right on. To the builders who have used epoxy/fiberglass cloth on the bottom and may be unimpressed now, let me add that if this method is done on the exterior then epoxy with fiberglass must be applied to the interior of the bottom as well. The strength needed on impact is most important at this location. This should be applied prior to installing the bottom to the frames. We have found S type fiberglass of 6 or 8 oz. appropriate for the interior of the bottom. The builder can then varnish over the interior of the installed bottom. On an oiled interior we apply graphite to the interior glass/epoxy bottom prior to installation. Then oil is applied to the frames and sides.

Fir plywood is the strongest material for drift boat bottoms. Builders should take care in applying fiberglass cloth to Fir. We recommend heavy epoxy coating along with fairing compound to smooth out the highs and lows of the Fir faces prior to fiberglassing. Also be sure to avoid core gaps in such plywood.

I used Fin ply as a bottom "shoe" for years until it became unavailable. One doubtful issue of it's use was that the core was made of Birch plywood. Birch is not rot resistant nor is Maple. In fact both rot very fast. The 1/4" "shoe" was applied with screws to the main bottom. The "shoe" was 5 ply and it was very strong but I always wondered how the material really faired in a marine environment.

I believe that a drift boat that is built with epoxy/glass on the interior and exterior along with epoxy encapsulation on all other parts and then painted inside and out gives the owner the most useful service. I owned a 14 Rapid Robert done this way and I had it for 6 years until I sold it to Deke Meyer last year. I built the boat in this manner and the only maintenance done was to wash it out. It looked like a new boat when Deke purchased it. Yes, I know we all like varnish but paint can be applied over the varnish when you get tired of the maintenance.
Permalink Reply by larry Hambley on February 7, 2010 at 1:42pm
You guys are fantastic. I believe I have learned more about boat bottom finishes and materials from your replies than I did in all the hours I spent reading everything I could find on drift boats! You provide a valuable service to us novice builders who don't have personal access to an "expert". My sincere thanks to everyone who has taken time to offer help and advice. I am sure I'm not the only one benefitting from these discussions.

Larry
Permalink Reply by Jason Knight on February 7, 2010 at 2:08pm
I like the idea of an oiled floor & interior. Just for the ease of maintenance. Clean the boat out, grab a can of the boat soup and let it fly. No cracks, no sanding, ready to go.
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on February 8, 2010 at 5:42am
This is a great discussion. Thanks Randy and Ray and everyone else.
Permalink Reply by mitchell on February 8, 2010 at 6:26pm
Larry,

You are so right. Your not the only one gleaning information from these discussions. This thread, that thread and the next tread. Even if I only understand a fraction.
Permalink Reply by M Quinlan on February 9, 2010 at 8:55am
Thanks everyone for all the great info and expertise. My personal takeaway for my boat is to encapsulation of my outside 1/4 inch Meranti with epoxy(maybe). Oil the insides and bottom with a shoe. I have never seen a wood drift boat being that I live in Atlanta. So I can't gauge what a varished vs. epoxied outside looks like . Sounds like epoxied sides would be pretty maintanence free , still allowing the beauty of the Meranti plywood to show . Lord knows, I spent a lot of time and money getting this wood to Atlanta ! So are we talking about sanding the outsides and just brushing epoxy over that or staining too ? Or lets say I decide to oil the whole boat , and latter on decide to epoxy my outsides , is that possible after it being oiled a couple of years ?

Also , I get some what confused when different parts of the boat are mentioned in these threads . Is there by chance a picture identifying all the different pieces on a drift boat? That would be nice to have posted on this site somewhere , for us novices . Just a thought . I am a visual person by nature.

Thanks ,
Matt
Permalink Reply by larry Hambley on February 9, 2010 at 9:35am
Matt, this is off topic but I was wondering where you intend to use your boat. I know there is some excellent trout fishing in the north Georgia mountain streams. But I did not know any were large enough for a drift boat. Just curious.

Thanks,
Larry
Permalink Reply by gs zoll on February 9, 2010 at 10:01am
There is a section in Roger Fletcher's book DRIFT BOATS & RIVER DORIES that has an illustration of a boat with all parts identified although some parts are referred to by different names by some people, it is easy to figure out when you know the basics. Great book on the history and building of drift boats.
Permalink Reply by M Quinlan on February 9, 2010 at 1:09pm
Thanks GS ,
I just mailed out my order for a signed copy !

Matt
Permalink Reply by M Quinlan on February 9, 2010 at 10:24am
Larry no problem , actually right down the Chattahoochee River all the way through Atlanta. Now this is not for the trout purists. There is a brown and rainbow stocking program on this river. So the best I can do, to get my family out enjoying fishing . Not uncommon to catch 20 -25 trout on a float , per person. There also are some nice size bass on the river too. Pulled a couple of 4-5 pound bass out of there too. I used to float the river in a tube. Rather do it by boat now. Experienced a hatch on the river once , saw atleast 1000 risers, I kid you not.

Every once in a while there is a 15 lb-18 lb brown taken out of river too (plug) . Now , I am not skilled enough to take one of those wiley eyed fellows though . There are stretches of it that an outboard can travel too. Also , if they will let me about an hour and a half north of atlanta , is the Olympic white water run on the Ocoee River . If they will allow , I plan on taking that on as well. There is also the class three/1V Chatooga not far away in NC.

In the winter , I will use my RR for Striped Bass fishing on Lake Lanier. 20 - 30 pounders are know to hit top water from 30 feet down . Quite a thrill . Sorry to ramble .

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