Wooden Boat People
By McKenzieDriftBoat.com
Boat Use Question?
I've been wondering for years how much actual whitewater most driftboats actually see? I'm not just limiting my question to wood built driftboats, but all driftboats, aluminum,glass, plastic,or anything else I'm not aware of.
By looking around this site you can see that some of the guys on here really put their boats through their paces whitewater wise. Everybody wants to be known as a whitewater hero, and some are, but really, how much whitewater do you actually use your driftboat in? And by whitewater I mean anything class 3 or above.
Mike
By looking around this site you can see that some of the guys on here really put their boats through their paces whitewater wise. Everybody wants to be known as a whitewater hero, and some are, but really, how much whitewater do you actually use your driftboat in? And by whitewater I mean anything class 3 or above.
Mike
Views: 460
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Jesse Ronnow on
-
I think the answer to your question probably lies in the answer to another question. Who introduced you to drift boats? For me drift boats have always been a means to an end... getting to better water and bigger fish. My first float was on the Green River in Utah, with my uncle and father to fish. I now own that boat by the way... any way I digress. I would love to learn the white water stuff but am pretty sure that I need to go with someone who knows what they are doing first.
-
Permalink Reply by Mike Dearing on
-
Jesse,
I introduced myself to driftboats I suppose. From the very first time I banked fished on the Rogue I knew that those funny banana shaped boats were the cats meow for freeing up the whole river to fishing, not just the holes I could access from the bank. So I saved up enough money and bought one of Greg's 17' kits and off I went after I built the thing. But that's a whole nuther' story I wont bore you with unless you want to hear it.
One of the reasons I asked this question is because I have a feeling most people are like you and to them their boat is more or less transportation, sort of just another tool for fishing. Not that one's boat doesn't have sentimental value, I just think most people miss out on a lot of fun not whitewater driftboating. I know this is the way it started for me to.
Mike
-
-
Mike,
For sure. When you started running white water, did you go with anyone that was proficient? Or did you just give it a go? I guess the caution side of my brain is saying... "don't drown". Or possibly and equally important in today's economy, don't kill you boat.
JDR
-
-
My intro to whitewater was very slow and totally self taught. After I built my woodie I rowed around some lakes for a couple weekends before I ever put the boat on moving water. A few weeks later I moved up to something harder, and so on....It was a school of hard knocks literally for me and the boat. Almost all the damage I did to my boat was in the first year of rowing it. It was amazing really that I didn't sink it or have more bad experiences then I did. The old saying really proved true for me, "You've got to be tough to be stupid."
On most rivers if I had doubts about what line to take I just waited for somebody else to drift through and then tried to emulate what they did and where they went. Which worked out ok as long as there were other boats around.
If I had it to do over again, I would have bought my rafts first to learn to read water in because they are so much more forgiving, then graduated to the driftboats.
Mike
-
Permalink Reply by lhedrick on
-
Mike,
I built my boat to fly fish the Green in Utah below Flaming George dam. Just a few class 2 and 3 runs. I have floated this section many times each year for many years.
Then I took the boat down Desolation Canyon on the Green in spring when it was flowing at about 8000 CFS. While I never took on 5 gallons of water in 7 days, I easily could have. The next year a friend scored a permit to run the Yampa. We were having a record snow year and I knew an open boat was not acceptable for this run. I went to work and decked the boat over. You can see images of my and other boats at:
www.pimpmydory.com
We arrived the day before Launch with the river running at 24000 CFS. The second highest flow in 50 years. The next day we launched at 17000 and by the time we got to Warm Springs Rapid the flow was about 13000. I took a big hit on that run which would have swamped an open boat. Taking an open Claka or Hyde down river with big flows would be foolish. They are fishing boats not whitewater boats. You might get away with it once or twice but sooner or later it's going under water.
My boat is now fully deck with compartments and hatches. It is also self bailing. It is also no longer a good boat for fishing. I packs out well for longer trips with the decks. A drift boat is a fishing platform which has a specific use and with an experienced rower can handle some heavy water but, you can't run the Grand Canyon in an open fishing boat.
I am building another fishing platform now. If a person wants a drift boat for fly fishing I would not recommend a fully decked boat
Larry
-
Permalink Reply by Dave Z on
-
I wish I had more real WW with trailer access near me. We have some awesome kayaking, but the access to the good stuff is tough with a DB.
I do run at high water sometimes that make for fun floats when the fishing is poor.
-
-
Larry,
Those are some great pic's. Thanks for sharing. That is the type of river running that I have always thought of as "raft" water. All pretty new to me. How big is that Green decked boat under your page on the dory web site? It appears to have much higher sides that the boats that you see used for fishing.
JDR
-
-
I agree Larry.
I think of your kind of Dory as the extreme of whitewater driftboating for sure. Nice site btw. I also agree that one boat can't do it all. That's kind of why I ended up with two rafts. I progressively ended up running bigger/more technical water and got to where I knew it was time to put some rubber between myself and all the rocks I would be hitting. I've always felt that most "open" driftboat are really only safe up to class 3 water, and even then you better be on top of your game. Sure you can run some class 4 stuff too, but you are really putting yourself, passengers and gear at a fairly high risk IMO at that point.
Its funny you mention both Clacka and Hyde boats. I think both these boat mfg cater to the class 1-2 boating crowd and especially the fly fishermen, which if you are just using your boat as transportation, from one wading spot to another, I suppose would be ok. I'm kind of jaded because of where I boat most, the Rogue. You see a few of these types of boats on the upper sections of the river cause its fairly mellow, but in all my trips through the canyon I have not once seen one down there.
All that said, I still think that 80% of the people that own driftboats never see anything above class 2, and that's a shame because there's a lot of personal challenge and fun in running water that is more challenging.
Mike
-
-
Jesse,
The boat you are talking about is a design of Sandy Pittendrigh. Sandy runs the following web site:
montana-riverboats.com
The boat is designed to build form 4 sheets of 4 X 8 plywood with vitally no waste yielding a boat of about 14 foot 6. It is wider up front for good stability while casting from up front. I am current working on a boat which started from the same design and I have stretched to get the length up to 16 foot.
As for the sides they are not really that high since both sides are cut from 1 4 X 16 foot sheet. To get higher sides would mean getting 2 more sheets to yield 2 sides which would be higher. Cutting from 1 X 16 foot panel means that if the stem gets higher then the stern must go down.
As for white water boats, they are just more fun the rafts. With a wood boat you need to have enough scrap plywood epoxy, glass and tools on hand to fix a hole when you take a hit. Pull over make camp, patch the hole, drink some beer and laugh about it. I have been on 4 trips where dories have had hole put in them. It's no big deal, you just fix it and keep floating. A wood boat will last forever.
L
-
Permalink Reply by Herb Jacobsen on
-
A lot of use depends upon where you live. I lived on the Olympic Peninsula for years and we had a lot of rivers to run. Some are fairly docile others pretty rocky and steep. I got into boating as I saw one on the river once and decided standing in the water for winter steelhead was no longer for me.
I got into boating pretty much on my own. Eventually I went to work for outfitters on the Rogue and in Idaho. We have run the lining channel at Rainie Falls when the river was up a bit. That is not for everyone. I was lucky as I got into the business and boated with some of the best.... Was I intimidated to begin with, Yes....
I will always remember what one guide said to his clients when they asked him if he was going to take them through some tough water. He said,"the water goes through, don't it"....
Try the South Fork of the Calawah or the Upper Sol Duc if you want some boating experience. As one friend told me "all you have to do is dodge more rocks"...
When I guided in Colorado I ran my Clacka down the Eagle because they told me I couldn't make it. They said only a raft could do it. Not too much ego involved there.......
Just my 2 cents......
-
Permalink Reply by Greg Hatten on
-
Great topic Mike.
For me it has been a progression. I fell "head over heels" (literally at times) for Steelhead on a fly rod. After wearing out several pair of waders a season I wanted to extend my reach in pursuit of "fish" so I started shopping for a drift boat. I considered the options and quickly developed a "crush" on our local McKenzie style drift boats made of wood. I became obsessed... built a Tatman design & put it on the water. I spent the first couple of seasons running Class I & II and was happy as a clam, catching Steelhead from a boat and reaching water I couldn't reach on foot.
Kept hearing this little voice calling me to try Marten's Rapids on the McKenzie - a challenging little Class III so I inquired at my local Caddis Fly Shop... "what's the line for that stretch"?? Chris Daughters drew me a little diagram on the line and the bow position & off I went. It was a thrill. After that, I started inching up the river - section at a time. Running more and more difficult water and getting as big a kick out of running WW as fishing. Almost always solo.
One of the highlights of my combined obsessions was this fall on the Rogue trip (that I posted on this site). A perfect junction of challenging water to run and great fly fishing. I immediately put in applications for the Middle Fork of the Salmon and the Wild and Scenic Rogue for 2009 when I returned from that trip.
Personally, I get a kick out of running a boat that I invested hundreds of hours in building and learning how to row - through white water that could destroy it even if I'm careful and skillful. On that Rogue trip, I was fortunate to go down with some guys that really knew the river and knew how to row... Paul Carusso was my tour guide and lead boat on that trip and is as good on the oars as anyone you'll meet.
Long winded way of saying, I love the combination of white water and fly fishing from a classic wooden drift boat.
GH
-
-
Larry,
I dig the decked boats man, they do look very cool and for really big water like the grand I bet they are a blast. Don't know if I'm so much with you on the the shore fixes though, that sounds like a major pain. Also, even though I've never been in a decked boat before, I don't know if I would say they are more fun then rafts. For running big or technical water a raft is hard to beat. When things get really, really technical I like my 14' cataraft better then all my other boats period. That thing will stop, turn, spin and punch holes better then any boat I have ever rowed, its awesome.
Herb,
Great stories! I remember seeing pictures of your boat on Greg's website when I bought my driftboat kit many years ago.
I agree with you on boat use being affected by where you live. What I have noticed about the Rogue though is the upper sections of the river are literally overloaded with driftboats, guides and private boaters. Anyone who's ever tried to fish for fall or spring Salmon on the upper sections knows exactly what I'm talking about. It is literally combat fishing at its worst.But yet at these same times of year the canyon is devoid of driftboats except for people paying guides to take them down. So this is what I am talking about. How come you don't see more people fishing what I consider the best part of the river? I think the fear of running it is whats doing it.
Greg,
Nice background story. I really enjoy hearing how other people get involved with rivers and boating them. I agree with your opinions about the Rogue too. I am drawn back to this river over and over, because I also think its the perfect mixture of boating, camping and fishing . I rafted the Wild section many times before taking my drfitboat down there, mainly because I like to camp like a king and can load ungodly amounts of gear on my raft and it doesnt even flinch doing so. But to tell the truth, I always thought they over rated the rapids down there, almost all of them seemed one class to high IMO. BUT, I finally got the chance to use my driftboat down there last year and knew instantly why the rapids are rated they way they are. The pucker factor in the driftboat was twice as high then in my raft. Even though I had been through every rapid many times and knew where to go, there's a little voice in your head when rowing a drfitboat that keeps telling you that if you blow it your gonna sink, not flip or bounce off like you do in a raft. I still enjoyed it greatly and look forward to doing it again soon.
Great stuff guys keep it coming.
Mike
© 2024 Created by Randy Dersham.
Powered by
